#95 - Paul & Danny - We’re Rebuilding The Podcast Around Strength and Nutrition For Jiu-Jitsu

We reset our mission and put strength, nutrition, and injury prevention at the heart of the show, sharing real client stories that prove what smart training delivers. From a 33-kilo cut to competing with a ruptured ACL to a white belt moving up a division, we show how simple systems beat chaos.

If you need any help, guys, just reach out to either Danny or Paul. We’ll get the new program up and running pretty soon and yeah, we’ll give you all the details.

Chapters

• 1:29 Reset And New Direction
• 2:11 Body For BJJ Announcement
• 4:02 Coaching Focus For Grapplers
• 4:16 Big Mark’s Weight-Cut Journey
• 8:57 Training Through The Tough Weeks
• 9:35 Strength Work For A Judoka
• 10:12 Kylie’s ACL And Hip History
• 12:47 Building Stability Without An ACL
• 14:49 Competing Safely And Results
• 16:53 Rehab Culture In Grappling
• 18:14 Tommy’s First Steps And S&C
• 20:42 Programming Strength And Power
• 21:46 Moving Up A Weight To Compete
• 22:45 Lessons From First Competition
• 24:50 Why We’re All-In On Coaching

Transcript

SPEAKER_01: 0:48

And we're live.

SPEAKER_00: 0:51

Alright, grapplers, we are back. We are back in the studio. How you been? Hope you're good. Um, so guys, we've obviously not been releasing episodes as frequently as we have done for the last couple of years. So as you know, we've always been pretty frequent and releasing a guest episode every single week. So recently we've dropped off a little bit, and the reason being is because you may or may not know, but Danny and I are both fitness professionals, but we were doing other things as well. So I was in a leadership role, Danny was running a business. Um, recently we've decided to basically go full-time into sort of fitness and online coaching and strength and conditioning and everything else. So that's taking a little bit of a priority at the moment, but we will be back with guests very soon. And moving forward, the the podcast is going to be a little bit more tailored towards strength conditioning, nutrition, and sort of injury prevention and general fitness for grappling and jujitsu. So Danny and I will be talking a little bit about some of the clients we've been working with already. And when we're talking to guests, the conversation will always be about jujitsu, always be about grappling and giving you guys value, but also talking a little bit about what they're doing off the mats to prepare their bodies for jujitsu and competition, anything else they're doing. Does that sound like a pretty fair summary of the situation?

SPEAKER_01: 2:05

We're also releasing our new program Body for BJJ. Um, we're gonna really focus on that and we're gonna we're gonna be pushing that um to help you guys basically because we don't think there's enough out there that's that's actually like you know, good enough for for what for what you guys need. So we're gonna we're gonna push that pretty hard over the next uh six months, eight months, you know, and uh try and get it on track.

SPEAKER_00: 2:29

Yeah, and guys, it's gonna be a very low price point. So give you guys the ability to get some really good coaching and some really good direction in regards to your training off the mats for a very low price point. Um, we'll be building in a little community as well. We'll be doing regular webinars and probably adding in a few other bits as well, like educational content around sort of other things, more holistic things, talking about injury prevention and uh yeah, and I think probably doing a little bit of jujitsu instructional or just fucking around a little bit, rolling around on the mat, trying to act like we know what we're talking about when it comes to jujitsu. So, yeah, like Danny said, watch your space, we'll be releasing that in the in the coming weeks or months, and then yeah, be pushing that pretty hard for you guys uh moving forward. Excited. Yeah, be good. Yeah, it's gonna be good, but yeah, we will still very much be the grapplers' perspective and still talking to guests on a regular basis. I think Danny's gonna try and get in a good episode this week, so we'll get that out pretty soon for you. And uh yeah, we thought we'd also talk today a little bit about some of the people that we've already been working with, so some of the not just jujitsu people, but judokas, but grapplers in general. So we've both had a couple of clients that have had some uh real success recently. So we thought we'd talk about that. Do you want to start with Big Mark?

SPEAKER_01: 3:37

Where do I start with Big Mark? Hey, shout out to uh Mark Adams, the big bastard. He's um yeah, he's done unbelievable, mate, any. He's uh he started at 132 kilos last year, and uh we had a goal of getting him to under under a hundred, so that was a pretty fucking hefty goal. So that was the start of the year, but we didn't we lost maybe like 10 kilos, 10 kilos in in six months, maybe, and we were kind of ifing and am in. And then we decided to go fucking all in to get him under a hundred for the judo veteran champion world championships in France, um, which was like a few weeks ago, and uh yeah, we made it, we we done it. We got down to 99.3 kilos day before weighing. So, you know what what can you really say? Like he followed everything to a T. You know, he he just he just smashed it, mate. He what I liked about Mark is he just trusted the process and understood that sometimes he's not gonna constantly lose weight, it's not gonna be huge amounts of weight coming off all the time. There were some times where we plateaued him, sometimes where it was a bit difficult around work, you know, and around training and energy levels and all that type of stuff. But realistically, you know, for him to go from 132 kilos in January to then you know this year, it's gonna be well, he's gonna be coming at up around a hundred kilos.

SPEAKER_00: 4:58

It's is fucking a great year, isn't it? It's pretty amazing, mate. And uh just rolling with the guy is so much nicer. I can't thank you enough, mate, for getting that weight off him because rolling with him. He's a he's what is he, a fifth down fucking judo black belt and a a brown belt in jiu-jitsu. He was horrible to train with at 132 kilos.

SPEAKER_01: 5:16

So, um yeah, because he used his weight so well, you know what I mean? He just fucking just distribute his weight so well, and you couldn't stand up with a fucker because you'd be launched, so you'd always have to start bottom, and then when you start bottom, he's just crushing you. But no, I'm I'm super proud of him, mate. He done he done so well because again, it's one of those things, and it I think he was over you know, that sort of weight for a long time, and it can be difficult if you've got that mindset. Like, I'm just a big dude, you know, he's just I'm just gonna stay at that that heavy weight for for a certain amount of time, and it was getting past those like barriers, basically. I think that you know he could achieve that, you know. And um, we was only talking yesterday at the gym, we were doing a bit of a bit of a uh back session, and um we're talking about what we're gonna do next. And effectively, mate, we've we've chatted about him, we're gonna document us getting him to his best shape ever. So we're gonna we're gonna go for abs, mate, now so he might even end up going down to like 90 kilos or something. I think he's probably gonna have to go down to about 90 kilos to to to see his abs. But mate, what that would be crazy, wouldn't it? How long do you know Mark for? And and to see him looking like that would be just just unreal. But I think uh you know he'll be a victim, man. He'll be in victim weight category.

SPEAKER_00: 6:29

Yeah, about time, mate. But yeah, it's good man. How did he um how did he kind of find his training during that that calorie deficit and that drop?

SPEAKER_01: 6:37

Well, it was difficult towards the end. I think that was the only time, maybe like the few weeks before, was you know, we was about maybe two weeks out, 104 kilos. So we had to drop some some water, pull back on his carbs and his glycogen and his sodium levels and stuff like that. That was the only part, and I think he'd agree that was tough. And I had to be a bit hard on him. But most of the other time, mate, it it's as simple as uh calories in, calories out, giving him a good regime, giving him some autonomy to feel that he can choose what he can do as long as he sticks within his calories, and yeah, he just he just he just done it, mate. And he wasn't snacking and cheating and not tracking, and we just made it as simple as possible. We just give him a plan, like because he's a truck driver and he just does different shifts. It's like we had to find a way where he was when he was working long hours that he wasn't overeating or snacking, or you know, through the night sometimes getting bored, you know, and just eating shit, or uh that was our biggest hurdle. But once we once uh things become a habit, that was the big thing. It's like it takes 66 days for something to become a habit. So that's what we aimed for basically was to make sure that his breakfast and his dinner was pretty much the same every day, and then we just he could eat what he wanted for tea effectively as long as it was in his macro goals and calorie goals. That's how we done it, and we give him autonomy just to be able to eat what he wanted pretty much, and then even with those two meals that we did choose for the breakfast and dinner, that was something he liked. It wasn't like you know, shit.

SPEAKER_00: 8:13

Yeah, nice. And you um obviously just you didn't just work with the nutrition, you also did some strength conditioning as well. Yeah, so yeah, tell us a little bit about that as well.

SPEAKER_01: 8:21

So with his S and C stuff, we just focused on power, trying to get him stronger. Um and we just we just focused a lot on like compound movements. We've done a lot of cleaning jacks, a lot of um deadlift in squats, we done we've done movements in which a Judoka would need you know, he he needed a strong posterior chain, he needed to be able to move explosively. We were doing we weren't doing as much, um especially towards the end, like super heavy sets because he just didn't quite have the energy, maybe sometimes. And obviously, because we needed to lose weight, we switched it more towards like uh like hit workouts with some SNC thrown in there, but yeah, that's why we focused. That's what that's what we've done, and and we just smashed it and just yeah, just nailed it. Yeah, nice man.

SPEAKER_00: 9:14

Yeah, it's good. And he uh he didn't think he meddled, but he he beat a Frenchman, which was uh that was his goal.

SPEAKER_01: 9:19

That was it. He went out there, he was like, I want to beat a Frenchman. But the the competition in judo is crazy, it's not like jujitsu guys, it's it's it's a different level. Yeah, these judokas, especially in France, mate, you know what I mean? Like fucking hell.

SPEAKER_00: 9:31

Well, it was the world championships, veteran world championships, but people from all over the world.

SPEAKER_01: 9:35

All over the world, but you know, he beat a Frenchman, that's all you give a fuck about, you know. The two goals were to get under a hundred kilos and beat a Frenchman, and he'd done both. So what a mark, mate. That was that was fucking an amazing effort and it was really good.

SPEAKER_00: 9:48

Yeah, sick man. And and interestingly, I've been working with Mrs. Adams, so Marks, Marks of a half, who's also uh a judoka and a competitor as well, Kylie. And she was also competing in the Veterans World Championships, but had a very different challenge in the sense that she uh back when she was doing um a grading, I think, back in the summer, she did a competitive round and then was basically doing like an open mat round with a smaller opponent and maybe just switched off for a moment or just got unlucky, but blew her knee and completely ruptured her ACL. So had a full thickness grades retail on her ACL. And Kylie won't mind me saying, but also going back a couple of years, she also had a full hip replacement as well. So we had a conversation, and she had had a full she'd had an MRI, had a scan, so she knew that it was a full fitness test, so there was no ACL attached anymore. So obviously, with judo being you know a high-impact sport that requires a lot of rotation through the legs, that's slightly problematic. But she was still adamant that she wanted to do the world veteran championships, which I think everyone advised her not to do. Yeah, yeah, including me. Um, but to be fair, we you know, as a as a as a kind of exercise rehabilitator or sports therapist, whatever you want to call me, we we just had an honest conversation, you know, it's always about the client and what they want to do, but I just had to explain that the risks, which were that there is a possibility that she could do further damage to the knee. Um, there's three other ligaments still attached that could rupture, and also a meniscus that could tear as well. Um, but she is still considering surgical intervention, but the the time frames just weren't available for her to have that done and then rehab and then obviously make the championship.

SPEAKER_01: 11:37

So it's a year, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00: 11:38

Yeah, it's a year rehab. Yeah, the nine months minimum. So she basically decided that she was going to go for it in a way and came to me to see what we could do in regard to strengthening the knee. And one of the things I identified quite quickly through some of just the sort of basic movement assessments was that she clearly had a weakness in the same side glute medius from the surgery. So she'd done some initial rehab from the the full hip replacement, had got to like a functional uh point where she could just do her activities of everyday living and get on the mats again a little bit, but it kind of stopped the rehab there. So there was a weakness that remained, and the the gluten medius is important for preventing knee bulgus. So what's that? So for people that don't know what that is. So that's basically where when you sort of bend your knee or squat and your knees collapse in together, um, so that's knee valgus, which puts a lot of pressure through the ligaments in the knee. So it's possible that her knee may have been compromised because of that weakness in the hip and the inability to stabilize that knee through a judo throw. So one of the things that we did really was just work on really strengthening that. So we we just you can't rehab an ACL that's not there, it's not attached, so we can't strengthen the ligaments. So we just had to strengthen the structures around the knee. So just everything that straps the knee up, really. So the uh you've got one of the adductors, the chorusillus that comes in and wraps sort of below the knee. You've got a sartorius that comes over from the hip down, and then your hamstring comes in below the knee as well. Your quads obviously insert over the front, and then your the gastronomius, the big part of your calf muscle, goes from the bottom above the knee as well. So you've got all these different structures that strap up the knee. So primarily we just focused on strengthening those things and creating some strength in her hips so that she could stabilize the knee through certain movements. Like you did with Mark, we worked on some like rotational strength and posterior chain strength. I didn't do any plymetrics with her because the wrist reward wasn't there for me. So stabilization could be a problem, couldn't it? Yeah. So we've now, since like post-event, I've started working in some like polimetrics with some like uh step drop-offs and sticking landings and that type of thing. But beforehand, it just wasn't worth the risk. Like we we did some balance work to try and improve like appropriate reception, so her ability to kind of know where her knee is. But yeah, I didn't want to risk her trying to stick a landing, like her knee slipping, and and then sort of doing fibre damage. So it was really about strengthening as much as we could, building some confidence, and she went out and competed. And I was worried that she something bad might happen, but she actually got through I think four matches pretty much like incident free. So she lost the the her first match to the eventual winner of a division, some giant of a woman. She then won the next two and then lost a third. So her goal was really just to get there, have one match, and try and come back with a knee that was working, yeah, no less intact than it already was. And she not only did that, she went out and got a couple of wins as well. So an amazing result for Kylie. What did she come overall? Seventh, wasn't it? Seventh, yeah, seventh in the world in her division for that. Yeah, incredible.

SPEAKER_01: 14:45

Fucking amazing, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00: 14:46

Yeah, so yeah, she's now come back and we're still gonna work together. But I think she's in a crossroads in the sense that she probably knows she needs that surgery at some point, but there's gradings coming up, she's not far off her next dance, so she's just got 16 points left to get. So there's a couple of opportunities to accumulate those points in the new year. She's got a holiday in May. So yeah, we'll see. We'll see what we can do without that kind of surgical intervention for now.

SPEAKER_01: 15:14

Well, she can manage without it as long as she's careful, yeah. You know, and she's trying to be sensible. Obviously, you the risk is always there. Yeah, the risk is going to be there no matter what what you do, but you can with with working with you and working specifically on those muscle groups. It it can help it a lot. And people go years, mate, without repairing their ACL, you know, as long as they're sensible with it.

SPEAKER_00: 15:36

Yeah, I think the the the the dangers are is downstream, it can increase the risk of osteoarthritis in the knee because you don't have the stability, so you're gonna create more friction and movement in the joint. And of course, if she does want to compete at a high level in judo again, then no ACL is gonna limit her ability to do as well as she could do with an intact ACL.

SPEAKER_01: 15:56

Yeah, she will need it done, but she can maybe manage it, get her done, get the things that she wants to do, and then get it done.

SPEAKER_00: 16:02

Yeah, but plenty of plenty of people survive without ACLs, you're right. And so I think with you know a good strengthening protocol, you know, and providing you're consistent with that, you know, there's there's definitely a way of mitigating the risk of of osteoarthritis as much as possible as well.

SPEAKER_01: 16:16

Yeah, and I think in in jujitsu competitors or judo competitors in general, they they really overlook like those sort of rehab times, you know, and it's like it was really refreshing to see. Yes, he saw one in the gym and he was he he paid quite a lot of money to see a physio and he was doing his rehab properly, and it was the first time in a while I've seen a jujitsu or martial artist actually take their rehab super serious. It was like I was like, fucking hell, well done, mate. Like, you know, it was it was really nice to see just them take it super serious and just do everything they were asked to do. And he was in there for about you know a good hour doing all his rehab work and that. And uh, you know, I think more people, if they took their SNC and they took their rehab more seriously, they would be on the mats longer, they wouldn't have as many injuries as they do. Like the amount of people I see then they're like, Yeah, I don't do any SNC, I don't do any strengthening work, I don't do any of this stuff, I just do jujitsu constantly, and but then they won wonder why their backs are hurting all the time, while their necks hurting all the time, while their arms, shoulders, elbows, fucking whatever, knees, you know. And you just need to take that time to be able to put in that work. You know, you might miss a jujits jujitsu session here and there, but the benefit will it'll be tenfold. You'll be on the mats for longer and you'll be happier and you'll you'll be stronger and better.

SPEAKER_00: 17:32

Yeah, 100%. I feel like I should tell you about my client Tommy actually on the on the note of that, because he's a really good example of someone that started jiu-jitsu and recognised that he actually needed that quite early on. So let me tell you about Tommy. So Tommy is um he's been coming to my fundamentals class, he's like, he won't want me saying he's a small dude, like 60 kilos, grown man.

SPEAKER_01: 17:51

It's like a massive man.

SPEAKER_00: 17:53

But mate, he's he's he's got the strength of like an 80 kilo man, mate. I tell you, he's got he's got a grey ST coach. But yeah, he's uh he's a he's a bricklayer, so to jokes aside, he's a strong lad for his size anyway. But he's never like done any sporting endeavour, and as he's getting a bit on in life and he wants to think about family, he was just aware that actually he's a small dude and wants to be able to defend himself potentially. So started jujitsu, been training for maybe for maybe five, six months, can only make it in about once or twice a week, so not a ton. Um, but quite early on, he he came to me in one of the uh fundamentals classes and asked for a bit of uh coaching. So we started doing some S and C and he's like like I say, he's never done any gym work before. Strong because he's a brookie, he's got a good grip, but yeah, just had never done anything, and not straight away, but early on, I had aspirations to then compete as well. Um, I wanted to just give it a go, which he he did recently, which I'll tell you about in a sec. But yeah, with him it was it was cool because it was kind of like the opposite to to Kylie in the sense that like we had somebody who was fresh, so he didn't have any injuries that we were trying to manage. It was an opportunity to actually take someone who's brand new to like training, gym work, and build them up and then run up to a comp. And it was uh yeah, the approach I took. So initially, like the first four to six weeks, it was just getting them used to like training and just getting them used to lifting. So I think like the SNC nerds called it like a general physical preparedness block where you basically just work on like movement, like building general physical qualities, uh like injury prevention, and just get someone used to bearing load through their joints, through their tendons, and just checking their technique is correct. So we did that for a bit. And because he's new, he got the newbie gains, so his like neurological systems like love in life and just starts firing up and he starts lifting quite quickly. And then once we did that, then I sort of moved him on to more of a strength block, so like traditional like power lifting type stuff and like reduced rep ranges, higher intensity or higher training load. Did that for about four or five weeks, and then we moved on just as we're getting closer to the comp to like more of like a power block. So we looked to like stabilize that strength, so we weren't pushing it, we're just trying to hold it, and then we were then adding in sort of like plymetrics and some like weighted plymetrics and that type of thing. And because we only had like an hour per session, um I use something called complex training, so that's kind of like a superset if you know what that is, with a with a bit of a gap in the middle. But we do like a heavy squat, for example, give them a minute, and then we go into some like box jumps, um, give them a minute back onto the squat, and then we rotate like that, and then we've pushed like chest chest press, barbell chest press into like a plow press up. So we started doing that, and also at that point started including some conditioning work as well. So he uh experienced the uh to bar on the assault bike for the first time, but fair play to him, mate. Like the the dude smokes a little bit as well, and he's got some lungs on him, mate.

SPEAKER_01: 20:40

Proper smokes or vapes?

SPEAKER_00: 20:42

No, I think he he has the odds uh of cigarette, mate. But yeah, he did great, and then he ended up competing, I think, uh a couple of weekends ago at the Devon Open. So he bought him Devon Open, um, which is uh a local comp that's run by uh film martial arts, really well-run comp. And because he's 60 kilos, he basically because most men aren't built that small, he he basically didn't have anybody in his bracket, so he was really keen to compete, but he basically got to that point where nobody else signed up. There were a few unapproved people in there, but they just didn't pay. So we thought he had like three, so we're gonna have like a round robin, and uh yeah, like literally about three days before, got a notification that he was getting a refund and didn't have any opponents. So we reached out to the organisers, uh the lads down at Flow who run the run the run the run the show and agreed to basically got two weight divisions, so he went up to 70. He went up to 70, so he went in and fought 70, and mate was not not like outgun really at all, certainly not in regard to his physicality.

SPEAKER_01: 21:44

No, no, not at all. I watched matches, yeah. No, no, no, I didn't I didn't even know that he went up to 70. Yeah, fair play, mate.

SPEAKER_00: 21:50

Yeah, so uh he did he did fucking amazing. He didn't meddle, but it was close. He he had a really tough first match, ended up winning it by two points from a takedown. Um, takedown we were working on quite a bit in training as well, so that was cool. And uh yeah, again, just was really strong in positions, just stuck to his fundamentals, didn't try anything daft and just like edged out a win. The second match, and you find this with white belts and a little bit in in all divisions, I guess, but you could have someone like Tommy that's been training maybe twice a week for about six months, to someone that's been training regular for two years, yeah, and he just ran into a guy that was clearly a lot better, yeah, yeah, yeah. And then they were getting subbed quite quickly, and then he had a third match which was for bronze, and mate, he was he was winning, he was winning like uh I think he was five free up until about 90 seconds, and then the the dude hit him with a couple of judo throws, um, and then just knocked the win that him and got him out, and then very quickly just shot up and ended up being him on points. But mate, he he he was buzzing his first ever like physical endeavor, sporting endeavor, first time he's ever competed in anything, let alone a combat sport. And he went in and fought for 12 minutes, held his own with bigger lads, yeah. And mate, he did fucking great. So, Tommy, good lad, well done.

SPEAKER_01: 23:02

Yeah, it's class, mate. And Tommy's a good lad, he's he's he's everything you want, isn't he? From like uh like a new white belt, he listens, he learns, like he's uh he's got no ego, you know, he's just there to do it, and he's like you said, it's it's class. If I played going up to uh 10 kilos, because again, like not many people would do that, they've just gone, oh that's fine, I'll I'm not gonna compete, you know. And and again, it's it's hard to it's it's easy for me to sit here and say, Oh, the outcome doesn't matter, it does matter. Like people say it doesn't matter, it does to you, to the person, you know, and for him to put put himself like on the line with a 10 kilo like discrepancy, especially for your first one, mate, is is massive, you know. I remember when I did my first one and I was I was a bit heftier then and uh you know I was in that over 100 kilo sort of thing, and I fucking hated it, mate, because I was just not as big as the other dudes, you know, and it does it does fucking weigh on you, you know, it does play on your fucking mind. You think and you kind of use that as an excuse. Well I did anyway, you know. Oh, it's fine, he beat me because he's bigger, all right. Realistically, no, he's probably just better, yeah.

SPEAKER_00: 24:02

Probably probably the size helped that thing as well. Yeah, you uh you had a very different body composition back there, mate. So uh so yeah, it's good. But but mate, like since transitioning back into like full-time fitness, I mean I've always been in fitness, but as we've talked about, like um yeah, kind of working in more of a leadership role before. I literally thought the other day, mate, just like working with Tommy and seeing him do well, working with Kylie and and like a ton of other clients like online and face-to-face that are just like normal busy people as well. Mate, I fucking love this shit. I'm so I'm so glad to be back, mate.

SPEAKER_01: 24:33

Yeah, it's so it's so it's so rewarding, mate. I think it's nothing better than actually helping someone who wants your help, listens, and gets the results they want. You know, it's like it's nothing really better, is there? Yeah, you know, and um I think just going forward, mate. I think if we you know, we've both um, you know, took a step back from the podcast slightly just to re-realign ourselves in what we actually want to do. And um I think it's gonna be better for everyone, I think it'll be better for our listeners, I think it'll be better for the people we help, I think it'll be better for even the athletes, because again, we can help athletes and we can give them some advice, you know. And um yeah, I'm really excited, mate. I'm just really excited to keep keep pushing forward and and carrying on with the podcast and and helping people. So if you need any help, guys, just reach out to either me or Paul. Um we'll get the new program up and running pretty soon and yeah, we'll we'll give you all the details.

SPEAKER_00: 25:25

Yeah, peace out, guys.